TP throwbacks: Will of the Empress

[Kypriotha]

The first of the Emelan single novels, this week's TP throwback is Will of the Empress. The four being at odds at the start of the book is a stark contrast to where we left them at the end of Circle of Magic. This is the place to share all your thoughts on the beginning and end of WotE and everything in between!

[devilinthedetails]

-I did sympathize with Daja, Tris, and Briar feeling adrift after learning that they will be expected to move out of Discipline permanently. That uncertainty of what life will be like after leaving your childhood home is definitely one that I can relate to from not too distant personal experience. It was probably the best and most believable aspect of the beginning for me.

-I do find it understandable that Daja, Tris, Briar, and Sandry would grow apart after spending so much time apart during their formative years. It is natural that people grow apart as they mature, but they were quite hostile to each other for quite flimsy, illogical reasons that I found difficult to accept. Basically, I like the premise of them growing apart due to their different experiences and time separated from one another but found the execution lacking.

-The tension and arguments between Daja, Tris, Briar, and Sandry were probably my least favorite aspect of the book since it seemed like these characters had regressed from last series to this book (they seem to be less mature at eighteen than at fourteen).

-Due to the constant arguments between the Circle, the first part of the book before they reach Namorn was rough reading for me, but after they reach Namorn, I enjoyed the book a lot. The court dynamics and culture in Namorn are so vividly drawn. I was definitely reminded of czarist Russia as I read about Namorn in this book.

-I love political drama such as that surrounding Sandry in Namorn. Sandry's internal conflict between her obligations to her people in Namorn and fierce desire for independence were poignant to me.

-Briar's traumas from the war in Yanjing. His nightmares and being reminded of the war by things that might seem random like ringing bells were very realistic, touching depictions of PTSD. In some ways, the trauma Briar describes in this book has more impact on me than the full account of it we get in Battle Magic. Perhaps that is because so much is left to our imagination. Sometimes the unstated can have more power than the stated especially when it comes to horror.

- Daja's romance with Rizu developed very organically to me, which was nice to see, especially in a YA work. I’m glad that Tammy became more direct over the years about showing characters with various sexual orientations rather than leaving it all implied or edited out.

-Sandry’s kidnapping was well foreshadowed, and the scene where the Circle reforged their bond to rescue Sandry was awesome to read. It really echoed back to the original forging of their bond in the earthquake in a way that was very effective for me.

- Ultimately I enjoyed most of Will of the Empress but could have done without all the bickering in the beginning. Once the story got to Namorn, it was hard for me to put it down.

[westernsunset]

I completely agree with devilinthedetails about how the tension between the Circle makes it tough to read the beginning of the book. It's hard to watch them fight and fall out of their closeness after you've spent four books wanting them to be friends again! I also completely agree that Briar's PTSD feels more visceral even than the war felt in Battle Magic, which I actually think is true with PTSD and combat/war zones specifically. In the moment, you're overtaken by adrenaline and then you come home and your body and mind still has to process (I've never been in a war zone myself, this is just what I've seen with members of my family).

That being said, I didn't like that so much of what happened to Briar went unsaid...basically up until Battle Magic! When I was re-reading the book last year I was like "wait did I skip a book? Why is there so much that seems to have happened since we left Briar?" That was a little confusing, even today, knowing there are other books.

Gay Daja!? oh, my heart! I think the reason I started reading the Circle of Magic books at all was that I heard there was a gay story in Will of the Empress and I was a closeted child and was like perfect I'll read all of them so it looks natural when I get to Will of the Empress and then I can really dive into this gay plot. It totally fits for Daja too. I just wish there was another story where we could see her being gay in the world! And the extra detail about Lark and Rosethorn?! *chef's kiss*

[devilinthedetails]

westernsunset, I know what you mean about wondering if you skipped a book since there seems to be such a gap between when we last see Briar in Street Magic and when we meet him again in Will of the Empress. I definitely had pretty much the same thought as you when I re-read the Emelan books recently. I'm thinking in future re-reads I might swap the order of reading to be chronological rather than publication order so I get to read about everything that happened in Yanjing in Battle Magic before reading about his PTSD in Will of the Empress. I wonder if that will change my perspective on this.

Your account of why you first started reading the Emelan books really reminds me of how important it is to include all the diversity of the real world into our stories so that readers of all races and sexualities can feel represented in fiction. I agree with you that it fit really well for Daja, and I would also enjoy reading more about her romantic relationships as an adult if another book was published focusing on her.

The Rosethorn/Lark mention was great. It was very powerful and casual at the same time. Felt like a subtle way of affirming how natural the Rosethorn/Lark relationship is at least to me.

[westernsunset]

I recently reread Battle Magic and I have to say, it did kind of hold up to all the build up we saw in both WotE and Melting Stones. But yeah, I wonder what it would be like to read them in actually chronological order (so opposite of how they were published!)

And yeah, I was always desperate for gay YA stories, and in the late 1990s and early 2000s, when I was a child without access to a computer, there weren't many out there! Actually, I know Tammy and Bruce Coville are friends, and Bruce Coville wrote one of my absolute favorite short stories that came to me at a time when I really needed it. I sent him an email over a year ago about how much that story meant to me, and he wrote back the sweetest email saying that of all his stories and books, Am I Blue? is the one fans write him about the most. Seems like I wasn't the only lonely gay kid who found solace in books!

[mistrali]

• WotE was a fun book to read. The plot wasn’t as tight as the previous books, but it was a nice adventure/travel sort of book.

• I’m not a fan of the timeskip. They should’ve been aged up to sixteen in CO, or they should have come back from overseas at sixteen and then not contacted one another till Duke Vedris sought them out individually.

Maybe Tris could have found a temporary job with Vedris or even Crane, or asked Niko to finagle something via his contacts. It’s not like she isn’t well known. So her trepidation about careers feels superfluous. I think it’s supposed to symbolise her coming of age, but it doesn’t quite work for me, since she’s so well known, talented and thorough, and has such tight control of her power. She could have any job she chose - as Ankhiale pointed out once, there’s great demand for her skills in engineering, in repairing structures, architecture, waste management, anything that would today be called the environmental field. Hell, even research and administration. I’m not sure that reinventing the wheel (and going all the way to Karang for it) is such a logical thing for her to do at this point.

All this makes for a choppy beginning. The fighting just seems to be there to create drama, and even that is patchy. Awkwardness would have worked better.

• Ishabal! Ah, I love Ishabal. She’s a strong-minded, intelligent character and it’s such a pity she was under Berenene’s thumb enough to curse Tris. She would’ve made an excellent mentor for Tris if she’d decided to stay on in Namorn. Like devil said about Jia Jiu, Ishabal has a personal effect on Tris, and so I find her much easier to connect to.

• I enjoyed reading about all the descriptions of fashion, and all the parties and dances. Once they got to Namorn, the pace picked up and I began to enjoy the book more.

• On the whole I like the contrast between Gudruny’s situation and Berenene’s. Sandry is somewhere in the middle. Obviously, Gudruny has been through a lot more, but Shan and Fin *do* manage to cut Sandry off from most of her powers. It’s only the telepathic link that saves her from being a prisoner,

We have the perfect glorified frat-boy, overgrown-university-student villain in Shan. I’m not sure why kidnapping seems to be so prevalent in the nobility. We don’t ever hear of it in Cold Fire, but then, Daja is far too preoccupied during that book to think about Namornese customs (and, you know, she’s only fourteen).

• In hindsight, Briar’s PTSD was the most disappointing thing for me. I absolutely agree that it had an impact and should have stayed the way it was.

• I wish one or two of the kids had stayed in Namorn. I’m also not too keen on the jealousy as a theme - like, yes, I get that they’re child prodigies, but surely not everyone Tris met was jealous of her, for example. It just seems like TP amped it up to create more drama.

• I liked the romance subplots and the intrigue.

• Favourite scene: The climax, and the end! • Totally agree about diversity. Emelan!verse has always been good in terms of its racial diversity (especially among the four Circle kids), but I loved that Daja’s storyline happened organically.

[devilinthedetails]

mistrali, I can't believe I forgot to mention Ishabal. I loved her character too since she was a woman who was powerful and intelligent as well as having that pull over Tris. In many ways, I felt like Tris was more tempted by Ishabal than Briar was by the empress's gardens. Ishabal knew exactly how to appeal to a clever, powerful girl like Tris. Perhaps she might have even seen some of herself in Tris, and thus knew how to draw Tris in based on that. Basically, yes, Ishabal is an interesting character to me, and she does remind me of Jia Jiu in the way that you mentioned. I also see some resemblance to Varice as well now that I think about it.

[mistrali]

devilinthedetails

Absolutely. I think the garden itself was every bit as tempting to Briar as he let on - but not as an inducement to stay at the palace. As a sort of vast museum, a cornucopia of wonders, maybe. He would’ve drunk his fill of all the beautiful collections of plants there - he might even have become one of Berene’s gardeners and gone into research. But to borrow the book’s metaphor, Briar is much more of a climbing vine than an orchid.

Briar likes his social interaction and his fun, but he also has to have a sense of purpose and a sense of value. I know that Berenene is overly flirtatious with him, but she never explicitly offers him a fantastic job opportunity with a decent supervisor, a network of colleagues and some good hard work (at least, not that we see). Which is very odd, because she is a gardener herself, so she should know what will click with him. We see a lot of sycophants, but no actual work getting done. Which is a shame, because if Briar had got along with her gardeners, he might well have stayed. The gardens were also not shown to us (readers) as tempting.

Just because Fin, Quen and Isha do their own thing, Berenene might not know that some mages are not (to mix my metaphors) lone wolves in ivory towers. She tries to catch him the way she caught everyone: with her personality. And just as she mistakes Briar, Daja and Sandry for empty-headed nobles, she mistakes Tris for a warmongerer. Not very good judgement there, not at all.

You’re right about Ishabal understanding how to appeal to Tris. I love the dynamic between them.

[devilinthedetails]

mistrali , yeah, I definitely think Briar was tempted by the gardens in the way that you described: as a beautiful place he could admire as a gardener. He might have even had the sort of feeling people sometimes get on a vacation to some place that seems perfect: that sense of wanting to be there forever but knowing that you can't because you have responsibilities elsewhere. Similar to perhaps how a non-American might enjoy visiting an American natural park like Yellowstone or the Grand Canyon. Maybe even so much that they vacation there again. However, they are unlikely to immigrate to America, leaving behind their loved ones and careers at home, to come live closer to the park, and if they did, the charms of the park might wear off due to familiarity. For instance, New York City doesn't impress me as much since I've visited it countless times since childhood, but it has a continual capacity to leave newcomers in awe. By contrast, Ishabal offers Tris a much more enduring and tantalizing opportunity. What Ishabal offers Tris is akin to the chance of being able to study or research at Harvard or Yale. Plenty of people would immigrate for a chance like that, or at least consider it much more than moving to be near a site of natural beauty. The Empress is a flirt and the garden is impressive, but her offer is ultimately nowhere near as compelling as Ishabal's to Tris, and I think that is why I feel the temptation more when Tris speaks with Ishabal than I do when Briar speaks to the Empress.

[mistrali]

Yep, Ishabal is offering a career; Berenene, just a pleasant diversion. The analogy of being on holiday vs being at Harvard is perfect.

Berenene’s greenhouse is probably one of its kind, but we’re not told how working there will advance Briar’s career. He’s already studied under one of the most famous plant mages in the world (two, if you count Crane), at what is basically a university. In all fairness, Briar isn’t exactly keen to explore the greenhouses further, so we don’t get to see much of them.

But at the same time it seems that - although there might be excellent gardening going on - they wouldn’t have the same sorts of research facilities as Lightsbridge.

Same with Sandry. She already has the kind of love and independence that she wants - in Namorn she might have met someone, but she would have been just an also-ran, considering how the empress ran her court.

[devilinthedetails]

Apr 27, 2019 9:13:12 GMT 10 mistrali said:

Yep, Ishabal is offering a career; Berenene, just a pleasant diversion. The analogy of being on holiday vs being at Harvard is perfect.

Berenene’s greenhouse is probably one of its kind, but we’re not told how working there will advance Briar’s career. He’s already studied under one of the most famous plant mages in the world (two, if you count Crane), at what is basically a university. In all fairness, Briar isn’t exactly keen to explore the greenhouses further, so we don’t get to see much of them.

But at the same time it seems that - although there might be excellent gardening going on - they wouldn’t have the same sorts of research facilities as Lightsbridge.

Same with Sandry. She already has the kind of love and independence that she wants - in Namorn she might have met someone, but she would have been just an also-ran, considering how the empress ran her court.

I think you're right that Berenene's greenhouse is probably the only one of its kind in the Emelan universe so that definitely makes it special, but it's hard for us to see how that would further Briar's career since he already had a chance to learn from Rosethorn unless he was going to be offered the change to grow/manage the greenhouse himself. Perhaps, though, there is more going on at the greenhouse than we get to see during the relatively short time Briar spends there on his tour with the empress, as you say.

Sandry is interesting because Berenene is trying to trap Sandry in Namorn by love and romance from her male courtiers but I never really got the sense that Sandry was tempted by that. To me, the responsibility she felt she owed to her people in the land she had inherited from her mother felt like more of a motivation for her to stay and ultimately she found a way to entrust that obligation to a relative she was convinced could fulfill it as well or better than her. Sandry's sense of obligation to her people felt much more real to me than any attraction she felt to the men Berenene tried to tempt her with, so in that way I think Berenene misjudged Sandry. Sandry isn't really motivated by flattery and adoration the way the empress is.